Frederica Freyberg:
Legislators and representatives of environmental groups gathered near a spring in Dane County to unveil a new groundwater protection bill. Groundwater is plentiful in Wisconsin but not unlimited. Large withdrawals have led to lower water levels in some state lakes and streams. The proposal would allow local governments to designate groundwater protection areas and put in place stricter regulations on high capacity wells. They pump water for things like agricultural irrigation and large factories.  One area likely to be considered for the designation would be the area in Waushara County where several lakes, including Long Lake, have dried up. We reported on the groundwater situation in that area last November on our sister program, "In Wisconsin." Brian Wolf, who owns a cottage on Long Lake, hailed the new legislation. 

Brian Wolf:
The best visual image I can give to folks is that if you can imagine water in a tub and you pull the plug on it. That's how dramatic our lake loss was. As I got involved in this process of water issues, people would come to me and say, you know, ‘Your lake went dry because of drought issues,’ or ‘Long Lake has gone dry before, it will come back as soon as we get enough moisture. Your lake levels will recharge itself and you will get your lake back.’ What bothers me with those comments is they don't give consideration to the significant increase in high capacity wells that we have had in our area. 

Frederica Freyberg:
No one wants to see Wisconsin lakes go the way of Long Lake, but there are people who worry groundwater management areas will put a pinch on agriculture and business. Senate Minority Leader Scott Fitzgerald is one of those. Sen. Mark Miller is the co-sponsor of the groundwater bill. Thanks to both of you for being here. First to you, Sen. Miller, having studied this issue and drafted these proposed new rules for groundwater, describe why you think we need these further protections. How critical is this in your mind?

Mark Miller:
I think it's very critical. Water is absolutely essential to our economy in the state of Wisconsin. Over a quarter of our jobs are directly related to water use, and the tourist industry is very much dependent on good quality surface waters. So if we're going to make sure that we have that resource available for jobs long into the future when water becomes much more valuable, it's important that we take steps now to use it in a smart way.

Frederica Freyberg:
And should citizens understand that actually we are depleting our water resource, I mean, our groundwater, and that's why these lakes like Long Lake are literally going dry?

Mark Miller:
Because we are a water-rich state, most citizens don't recognize that we're running short of water in some parts of the state, but those folks who live in that part of the state certainly do recognize it. What we're trying to do with this legislation is identify areas that if current trends continue, that we will run into water shortage problems, and in those areas where water shortages already exist to take steps to correct it.

Frederica Freyberg:
And current trends being increasing water usage and increased high capacity wells?

Mark Miller:
Increasing water usage, for whatever purpose. You know, we are an agricultural state, so we rely on irrigation. We are a manufacturing state that requires water use for a lot of manufacturing processes. We need to make sure that we are smart in the way that we use that resource.

Frederica Freyberg:
Sen. Fitzgerald, in terms of being smart, what are your major concerns about these new rules for high capacity wells?

Scott Fitzgerald:
Well, I've been around the Legislature long enough to remember when the debate started on Perrier and whether the high capacity wells they wanted to drill in the central part of the state was going to have an effect on groundwater. I thought there was a good measured response back then to that issue and that discussion, and that was to put together a bipartisan task force, a group that could work on a bill and that was passed in 2004, and I think that served us well. It is time to revisit it? I'm not so sure about that.

Frederica Freyberg:
Do you think these new rules go too far?

Scott Fitzgerald:
I do. I'm very concerned about a couple of the sectors that have always been strong for us, like agriculture and manufacturing and whether or not it would have a direct effect, beyond just the bottling that would also be, you know, part of corporations that do business in Wisconsin, and once again, I think we should probably proceed with caution on this. I don't think we will be served well to kind of ram something through or do something hastily at the end of a two-year session.

Frederica Freyberg:
Sen. Miller, what if a potato grower, for example, in the sandy soils of this state or a city or factory needs a high capacity well, but that well would be near a vulnerable stream or lake or waterway, do we say that well then can't be drilled?

Mark Miller:
Well, you know, there's a lot of different ways of managing the resource, and sometimes all you have to do is locate the well in a different area. Or, if you need the water to figure out if you are overusing the resource, then it becomes less and less valuable and usable to the current user. So if you were that potato farmer and a high capacity well for an ethanol plant was being proposed, I think you would want to be able to assure that the use of that water did not undermine your livelihood as a farmer.

Frederica Freyberg:
Well, I guess that's especially true, Sen. Fitzgerald, because you worry about job loss. We all would worry about job loss. We would worry about the farmer who needed the irrigation and couldn't get it. We would worry about the large factory who needed some high capacity well and couldn't get it, but what kind of job loss would there be if the water went dry?

Scott Fitzgerald:
Well, make no mistake about it, what this does is further empower the Department of Natural Resources to certainly develop more scrutiny and ultimately, I think even some rules that would empower the bureaucracy, and you know, we just visited that in a bipartisan way a couple of years ago when we said, ‘Listen, we need to cut through the red tape to actually make Wisconsin a good place to do business.’ I mean, if you are in a business that utilizes water, the last thing you want is for that water to go away, and that's why I think it's kind of counterintuitive to say that this makes sense. I really think it's also something that's being moved through the legislative process very quickly at the end of session, and I wish this would have been started two years ago, and we would have a lot more input than we have right now.

Mark Miller:
Actually, that's a mischaracterization. What this bill does is in areas where you are having the shortage, it empowers the people who are affected by that shortage to make the plans for how you will use the water. Once they complete that, then the DNR issues well permits in accordance with those plans. It very much empowers local jurisdictions.

Scott Fitzgerald:
For an individual, maybe, because now if one individual files a complaint, suddenly the DNR will be all over this. That's alarming to me. I don't know if that's something that we actually want to move towards.

Frederica Freyberg:
I understand that the people in the DNR are currently permitting high capacity wells, and they are working as fast as they can right now to get those out the door. I guess statutorily, they have 90 days or something, and they're working faster than that, but would these new regulations slow that permitting process and then impinge on economic development?

Mark Miller:
Actually, no. Because there's at least a minimum of three-year planning process before anything new would go into place, and so in terms of local groundwater management areas, and so there would be a lot of opportunity and time to go forward on a rational basis. In terms of the process for how we came to this bill, the 2004 legislation established the Groundwater Advisory Committee to make recommendations, and we actually used their two reports that they issued to the basis for this, the Groundwater Coordinating Council issued a recent report. The Wisconsin Academy of Sciences and Arts, and we have a lot of citizen input and research that went into the bill that we crafted and put forward this week.

Frederica Freyberg:
You're saying it's not just legislators under the dome, but there was a lot of scientific and other research that went in too. Not much time left in this session. What do you expect to happen this year?

Mark Miller:
Well, we’ve already had a number of public hearings when we put together the bill to make sure that we had the scientific input in particular. So the bill's out there. We will be meeting with various constituency groups, water users and so forth, to educate them in how the bill will operate and for them to tell us where they think it might be improved, and I expect we report it out and vote on it later in the session.

Scott Fitzgerald:
We've got four days left on the floor of the Senate, and the sponsorship for this legislation was just recently circulated. This is definitely a bill that's been fast tracked, and I'm not sure exactly where the support is.

Frederica Freyberg:
Well, we'll watch. Sen. Fitzgerald and Sen. Miller, thank you very much.

Both:
Thank you.